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Suggestion Remove otservlist subforum

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kay

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As in the title, I'm suggesting to remove that subforum.
It doesn't seem like there is any interest anyway, only about 10 posts were sent this year.
Not even xinn seems to care at all, as he's not answering there (and lately not even visiting otland at all).

Besides, I don't see a reason why this particular service is promoted (especially when it appears in otland board which may mislead people to think otland and otservlist are one, despite the red warnings inside).

Maybe that's one of the reasons why we don't see any proper initiatives in that matter - because it looks like otservlist has developed a monopoly within otland. I'm referring here to discussions such as: Should OtLand Open New OtServerlist site? (https://otland.net/threads/should-otland-open-new-otserverlist-site.272217/)

So if anything, maybe create a subforum for ots lists in general, where admins could post threads about their sites in which the users would discuss them (similarly to "server gala")?

Of course there would be only several threads at best and probably not much traffic too, but I still find it better to create an environment for fair competition rather than greatly favor one particular service for unknown reasons. Otherwise just remove that subforum.

Edit by @Znote:

Mod reply:
I read about two suggestions here, the first one is to remove the OTServlist board, and the second one is for OTLand to create our own OTSList. I can understand how the two suggestions can correlate with each other (but it's not a given). The board can still exist, whether or not we decide to adjust our own advertisement method of servers.

As has already been mentioned in a post above, OTServlist redirects traffic to OTLand (vice versa), and while neither I know the details of when and why the cooperation agreement between the two was made, I can still see the benefits of still having it.

Just wanted to let you know that we've noticed the thread and the feedback from other users regarding these two topics.

Hope you guys are having a good day today, it's really nice weather here in Stockholm today! 🌞🌻

Admin reply:
We link to that server list (and maintain a forum for it), because their website links to us in the main menu (the specific sub-forum).

There may be may reasons to like or dislike this list but I don't think us having the forum is any form of advertising it. We used to host so-called "Hosted Project Boards" back in the days, and many projects were relying on it instead of building their own forums. Building own forums became much easier and most other boards were retired with the exception of this one, because the website still exists (while other projects mostly ceased to function) and hasn't chosen to build its own forum. Other projects that would have had forums a while back (such as AACs) now use GitHub issues or discussion and also don't need to have such a forum.

The Otservlist board was specifically placed at the bottom of all the forums but since someone assumed that it being in the "Otland" category implies association, it was moved to the "Community Chatboards" category, therefore going up on the list. We don't have (nor need) a dedicated Hosterd Project Boards category to put it in separately, which would also make it more visible and cost more space.

If there was any other server list or really any OT project of any kind willing to have a project board and it would make sense, I'm still open to do that. Unfortunately, we haven't seen any other server list that would actually live long and have any substantial traffic and ask for a project board, which is why this one remains the only one.

Again, there is no association, no sponsoring, nothing to gain for us from having the board. But most importantly, there is nothing to gain from removing it at this point, which is why I'm not removing it.

there is no secret or lucrative arrangement between us and otservlist.org. We have hosted the "project board" pretty much forever and continue to do so because the alternative is simply for xinn to set up his own forum. Instead, it seems easier to have one larger forum. There is no endorsement, however. I know this forums stands out because all other "hosted project boards" are now defunct and hidden, due to those projects simply not being active. It is still simply a hosted project board.

This open discussion can continue and no decision has been made yet, nor am I implying that there is one necessarily coming. Civilized posts here won't be deleted and everyone can have their own opinion.

Official reply from owner of otservlist:
 
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Just figured I'd add my two cents (or have I already? can't remember):
  • I use otservlist.org for Dura for both paid advertising and to list the server
  • I also use other means of paid advertising and other server lists too
  • I monitor the amount of traffic that comes via otservlist
  • Each account created has a 'source' (i.e. google, facebook, specific email campaigns, otservlist)
  • otservlist currently ranks above all email campaigns but below everything else
  • With the data that I have available to me, I still deem otservlist valuable to advertise with and be listed on
  • I also got banned from otservlist.org for about a week (during active paid advertising campaigns) due to a change I made to the status protocol when implementing the first iteration of my global proxy network. I spoke directly with xinn, established the changes I needed to make, rolled out the changes and was promptly unbanned.
  • At xinn's request, I also implemented a new piece of data to the status protocol: 'unique' online. Since we don't allow MC on Dura this is generally pretty close to the 'online' amount anyway though with a small discrepancy for a few rl couples or a GM with two accounts online.


Do I think otservlist.org should still have a hosted forum here? No, I don't think it is a valuable addition to otland.
I would be in support of a dropdown menu that listed and linked to the active open tibia server lists in the top bar instead.
 
Inappropriate behavior toward staff (ref.: Global Rules, Addendum 4).
Wow, it's 06/27/2022, and Otland still does display a shit and allows people to play with it on their forum. Obscure and obscene.
Maybe the admin likes Dubai as much as some girls? :)
 
Wow, it's 06/27/2022, and Otland still does display a shit and allows people to play with it on their forum. Obscure and obscene.
Maybe the admin likes Dubai as much as some girls? :)
Looks like they have hidden that board though, or is it just me? Can't see it on the main page. The board still exists but can't see it displayed anywhere.
Why was there no word about that?
 
Looks like they have hidden that board though, or is it just me? Can't see it on the main page. The board still exists but can't see it displayed anywhere.
Why was there no word about that?
1656339900556.png
As long as it is indexed and has links to and from otservlist it supports each other.
 
I just want to remind that there are a lot of bad actors here on otland, who don't even try to hide their real intentions. There are also some perma-banned server owners here who simply have been cut out from a good source of advertisement, or simply our competitors - owners of other server lists. There are also people who simply believe their propaganda. Their only way of fighting otservlist is spreading lies about it. Verify information and keep in mind that if you are an honest person and you want a fair competition - those people are your enemies. There will ALWAYS be a conflict between us and them since we do as much as we can to fight them to allow a fair competition and deliver the most accurate data to visitors of otservlist.

There are a lot of things which I could do better lately, which gives ammo to those people, foremost - be more active here and finally update that damn list. True.
I guess it's time to put some new life into otservlist and add some new features which I've been discussing with some of you via emails or on discord. Unfortunately nothing is going to change about the free time I have and can spend on otservlist, so most of the work will be outsourced. If the reason why otservlist was hidden today from Hosted boards was because of my low activity - I will tell my co-worker to simply monitor otland every day and answer posts here. I don't really want to create our own forum and divide community. It doesn't benefit anyone.

When it comes to otservlist's rules - it seems that it's time to update them, and to clarify that server owners who use sophisticated spoofing techniques will be permanently banned (since there is a difference when someone counts 5mcs/IP instead of 4 vs someone who logs in 200 fake characters which try to imit real players). Also a new rule about encouraging people to masslog via vpns most likely will be added (or we will deal with that the other way - by marking such servers on the list). Maybe that will prevent some server owners from cheating.

Gesior's post was removed because of the lies about me banning servers because they stop paying for advertisement. It's really pointless to show proofs denying that over and over again. Most likely there was a situation where someone was banned few days after the ad ran off. But on the other hand there were also servers which were banned right after they started advertising, or a day after a fullmoon or a day Super Bowl was played. Correlation doesn't equal causation. There are right now 155 banned servers (most of them for 30 days) so obviously, we will have different scenarios (Statistics - otservlist.org (https://otservlist.org/statistics)). For example lately another big server (hold your chair, PAYING customer) from top10 was banned (Krovera). How does it fit this propaganda? ;)

@Iryont:
Also, Xinn knew the exact reason why I resigned from the list since he received the request on his email. Despite that he claimed within that post: "Most of the people were running huge rune-maker farms and that's probably why they didn't want to follow a new rule and was eventually removed from the list". What grinds my gears is the following part: "that's probably why they didn't want to follow a new rule"

You could tell me anything you wanted, but it doesn't mean that those were your true intentions or I simply believed you. At the time of removing your server from the list, your list of players contained huge number of mages around 11 lvls which indicates... rune makers. Similar login times indicates - farms. Back in time I could even show exact clusters. I tried to find a cache of the list of players on archive.org to back up those words - unfortunately it doesn't seem that anything like that exists. Not following the 4mcs/IP rule simply benefited you back then since you had around 1500 players online on servers, and after introducing that rule, the number of returned players to otservlist would drop significantly (and I believe we all know what snowball effect is). I can't show a cache of the online list then, however, we can check posts about Medivia from around 2016/2017 (afaik, later you fought with the farms by not allowing low-level mages to create runes unless they don't buy premium account - at least that's what I read on your forum).


Otland forum:
As of right now legacy has a whopping 617 players online right now, wow, great! Let's take a closer look... Well... only 94 players are above level 30, the vast majority under 20. Must just be a coincidence , right?

(...) As I stated in the other post he "implies" 1750 players are online. But digging deeper you can see 1300 are under level 25, most mages. If you try finding many of them are unreachable, probably placed by him himself. I don't know for sure, but that's just my opinion.

You can just google Medivia rune makers/farm bots/vpn farms to find info about that.

You defend yourself that you didn't want to share the list of IPs because of privacy. Fine. You could propose me signing an NDA. We are both from Poland, so law enforcement would be easy in case of a breach on my part. We could easily work that out, but you decided to drop free source of advertisement. I made such statement since everything was pointing out that indeed you have a huge number of multiclients on your servers, yet you don't want to correct the returned number of players online and let me check Medivia if you really started following the rules. Too bad you never talked about that publicly then - it would be way easier for me to show proofs and even estimate the number of players without mcs. Well, maybe those MCs were fake characters - we can't be sure of that now.
Don't whitewash yourself. It benefited you so you rather wanted to have your server removed from otservlist than let people know a more accurate number of players online on your servers.

@kay:
One could think it was his concern to keep his list reliable and free of invalid or fake entries, right? Well, no. Not at all. He replied that he wouldn't be removing it, because we weren't using otservlist and Tibiantis wasn't a protected name. He basically told me to add our server to the list, to prevent those entries.
Excuse me? I actually removed it from the list and told you that if you are afraid of low-populated server stealing your players you should add your own server to the list. Later it turned out that it was actually Tibiantis's IP.
You make such a big drama about that while you could just block otservlist from connecting to your server with one iptables command, right? :)
Anyway, why you didn't show people my FULL message to you, where I say that I've removed the server? Wouldn't it fit the propaganda?

You forgot to mention Medivia later magically re-appeared on the list,
Yupp ~2 years later Iryont added it once again to the list. :]

We here at Tibiantis never intended to put our server on the list, yet just after the start someone (or xinn himself, who knows) added it.
That's ridiculous.

And when you resign, he may randomly jump in your server's thread and post lies that you were removed for not following the rules, even if it was your own decision, as seen here
And wasn't that the reason why Medivia was removed from the list? I emailed Iryont about the rule change/gave him time to patch the server and wanted to check it if he started following new rules, yet he didn't want to patch the server and let me check it.
So yea, he didn't want to follow the rules and was removed from the list. Obviously, the server would be removed despite his email.

Oh, and not to mention that when you reach certain online number you are forced to pay, otherwise you are automatically removed from the list and marked as "banned for spoofing" in the public's opinion. This is in otservlist rules.
That's fantastic information! So players do trust otservlist :) Anyway, servers are not being removed from the list (that would be irrational), people can still find such servers via a search or using their "fav lists".

It's all even more ridiculous, when you think that website was literally the reason why people began to spoof their online numbers and overtime pushed it to the limits.
Of course, that's how people work - they try to be rational. If they see that something benefits them, they will optimize towards that. If a list was displaying servers based on a number of votes - they would cast fake votes, if a list was displaying newest servers on top - people would keep removing and adding servers to the list. Why? Because they know that potential clients (just like in search engines) would look first on the servers displayed on top of any list and by being there, they would have the highest chance of obtaining new clients.

@Michael 4463:
Thank you for that post. Maybe it will shed some light to those falling into that false propaganda "pay or be banned, pay so you will not be bothered with spoof checks" etc.

@Ahilphino:
it would be obvious to anyone it cant be listed there when its 90% afk macroing runemakers
I share the same view.

@ynneK
We talk often, you know how it is. Some things never change.
 
You could tell me anything you wanted, but it doesn't mean that those were your true intentions or I simply believed you. At the time of removing your server from the list, your list of players contained huge number of mages around 11 lvls which indicates... rune makers. Similar login times indicates - farms. Back in time I could even show exact clusters. I tried to find a cache of the list of players on archive.org to back up those words - unfortunately it doesn't seem that anything like that exists. Not following the 4mcs/IP rule simply benefited you back then since you had around 1500 players online on servers, and after introducing that rule, the number of returned players to otservlist would drop significantly (and I believe we all know what snowball effect is). I can't show a cache of the online list then, however, we can check posts about Medivia from around 2016/2017 (afaik, later you fought with the farms by not allowing low-level mages to create runes unless they don't buy premium account - at least that's what I read on your forum).

The issue was not whether you believed my intentions back then or not to protect IPs of my players, but to actually honor my decision and simply remove it from the list. That was all fine (from both sides) until you decide to jump into our thread after months since the removal (AFAIR 8-9 months) to start with the allegations. It seems like you only wanted to act like a judge to call out servers which didn't care about your list at all. You seem to fail to realize that and you still usurp right to judge everyone around who doesn't want to use your list.

You can just google Medivia rune makers/farm bots/vpn farms to find info about that.

Thank you for this great opportunity of giving me a way to look again through the history I am very well aware of. I have literally said this several times, both here and on other otland threads of Medivia and countless of times elsewhere (including our own Discord) that Medivia had a lot of MCs back then (years ago). I have never hidden that fact, yet still somehow people such as yourself bring it up to back up some meaningless statements. However, as said, this was not the issue back then because for a short period of time I did count players the way you wanted before the removal (maximum 4 players per 1 IP). In fact, if you take a look at the history of our emails I even gave you a way to count that way with a single MySQL query, so other customers of yours could benefit from a simple solution to follow your rules.

You defend yourself that you didn't want to share the list of IPs because of privacy. Fine. You could propose me signing an NDA. We are both from Poland, so law enforcement would be easy in case of a breach on my part. We could easily work that out, but you decided to drop free source of advertisement.

It seems like you fail to see the truth that your list is totally useless for us and for many others. I honestly didn't want us to be on that list, yet you fail to see that within that and previous statement.

You defend yourself that you didn't want to share the list of IPs because of privacy. Fine. You could propose me signing an NDA. We are both from Poland, so law enforcement would be easy in case of a breach on my part. We could easily work that out, but you decided to drop free source of advertisement. I made such statement since everything was pointing out that indeed you have a huge number of multiclients on your servers, yet you don't want to correct the returned number of players online and let me check Medivia if you really started following the rules. Too bad you never talked about that publicly then - it would be way easier for me to show proofs and even estimate the number of players without mcs. Well, maybe those MCs were fake characters - we can't be sure of that now.
Don't whitewash yourself. It benefited you so you rather wanted to have your server removed from otservlist than let people know a more accurate number of players online on your servers.

Notice how you are trying to come up with a different reasons I left the list to fit your way of thinking. You simply don't accept the fact that someone doesn't want that "free advertisement" and simply don't want to be on that list, period. It has nothing to do with your rules, your way of managing it and everything else since it's yours, you can do what you want.

Anyway, your disgusting allegations with the "fake characters" are beyond any good taste at this point. That's precisely the reason why your attitude has now backfired after so many years.

Yupp ~2 years later Iryont added it once again to the list. :]

Take a look at your email where we had our last conversation (April of 2017). This was literally our last conversation. In fact, let me quote it since you apparently lost your mind in the imaginary world you have created:

2017-04-21 18:16 GMT+02:00 <[email protected]>:

Cześć

Proszę o usunięcie Medivii z listy. Nie mam pojęcia dlaczego dalej tam jest, tym bardziej, że ja od dawna nie używam protokołu odpowiedzialnego za status gry:


Dziekuję.


2017-04-21 20:22 GMT+02:00 <[email protected]>:

Witam,

Usunąłem.

Pzdr.

Translation:

2017-04-21 18:16 GMT+02:00 <[email protected]>:

Hey

I would like you ask you to remove Medivia from the list. I have no idea why it is there especially since I don't even use the status protocol anymore:


Thank you.

2017-04-21 20:22 GMT+02:00 <[email protected]>:

Hello

I did remove it.

Regards.

I asked you to remove it again (after few months when I requested the initial removal) because someone else did add it, even though we had no status protocol anymore.
 
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Notice how you are trying to come up with a different reasons I left the list to fit your way of thinking. You simply don't accept the fact that someone doesn't want that "free advertisement" and simply don't want to be on that list, period.
It seems like you only wanted to act like a judge to call out servers which didn't care about your list at all. You seem to fail to realize that and you still usurp right to judge everyone around who doesn't want to use your list.
It seems like you fail to see the truth that your list is totally useless for us and for many others. I honestly didn't want us to be on that list, yet you fail to see that within that and previous statement.
Exactly my thought :)
Before we started with Tibiantis, some people had been asking if we were going to reserve the counter at otservlist. We made our mind then, that we did NOT want to be associated with that site and why. Yet, just after the server starts I see it added on the list. So I kindly ask xinn to remove it (again, we did not even have the server status protocol). He tells me that I should add the server to his list in order to prevent those fake/invalid entries. Ofc we still didn't do that, and now I read that Tibiantis isn't there because we wouldn't be able to follow his "wow, so strict" rules due to some alleged "afk makers"? 🤣

Dude, you literally have servers that openly provide their players with tools to hide their IP in order to bypass your stupid rules. Hell, half of your list shows no fluctuation in the online numbers in the charts, no matter if it's 5am or 9pm, wednesday or saturday. You reply to one dataspoof report every 3(!) years. No one is afraid of your shitty rules, you dare to speak about the server with unique IPs rate at 97-98%. Where in two years I have seen more than 4 chars logged in from one IP maybe twice (when someone hosted a lan-party). I don't know if you're honestly that cynical or that dumb, that you just can't accept the fact we DON'T want to be on your list, period.
 
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I do not believe somebody would try to put tibiantis on otservlist that's not involed with this (xinn/torg users to troll kay) <- pick one
On beta stage, discord, PM msg'es, there [otland] and their forum he was spamming he will never use your list
Also sharing the same statement with @Ahilphino damn. You must really visit this forum once a year to not know such people like @Ahilphino and even agree with his msg'es
 
@Iryont:
until you decide to jump into our thread after months since the removal (AFAIR 8-9 months) to start with the allegations
Was that allegation or observation?

It seems like you only wanted to act like a judge to call out servers which didn't care about your list at all.
I will address second part of that message later.

Why you think it's about me wanting to judge your server or not. Why would I wait 9 months if only what I cared for was "judging a server which doesn't care about otservlist". Why not earlier? I wrote why I wrote that post - I've received many questions about your server so instead of replying to everyone it was more efficient to write one public post. You can even check the posts before mine in that topic. Are people talking there about medivia and otservlist or not? Are people asking why medivia was removed from otservlist or not? Besides that 1 post, did I ever talked publicly about your server? No. Do I talk about tibiantis? No. Your hypothesis makes 0 sense. So what makes you think I have some kind of problem with servers like medivia, which aren't added to the list? Isn't that some kind of megalomania?

It seems to me that you have a problem with the thing that I pointed out that the number of players on medivia was skewed by those rune maker farms. Why you bring this to the table 6 years later? I have no idea.

I honestly didn't want us to be on that list, yet you fail to see that within that and previous statement.

You simply don't accept the fact that someone doesn't want that "free advertisement" and simply don't want to be on that list, period.

Take a look at your email where we had our last conversation (April of 2017). This was literally our last conversation. In fact, let me quote it since you apparently lost your mind in the imaginary world you have created

Imaginary world ;) Again, you keep making those statements, so enlighten me, if you didn't want to be on the list, why you've added your server to the list 2 years~ later? You try to distort the history. How does it benefit you? Take a look at this screenshot, just to remind you the imaginary time, when a big man who didn't care about the list back in that time, didn't want to be on it... added it anyway... ;) Unfortunately medivia was automatically removed and we never really talked again.


@kay:
So I kindly ask xinn to remove it (again, we did not even have the server status protocol). He tells me that I should add the server to his list in order to prevent those fake/invalid entries
Lul, why you don't mention I've removed it? Why you don't mention that you could block adding it to the list with simply iptables rule (but you were to lazy to do that or didnt know that)? Why you cropped my reply, which contains the information that I've removed it from the list, making it sound like I didn't help you? Why you didn't show what you actually wrote to me, that someone added "FAKE" Tibiantis server (which was in fact YOUR IP address). You never wrote to me "someone added my server and I don't want it to be on the list". I completely have no problem with that (which has been proven by for example, removing medivia on requst from the list). Our conversation looked totally different. You also lie here:
"(again, we did not even have the server status protocol)"

If that was a true, your server wouldn't be shown on otservlist (instead, it would be shown as offline), but we talked about an online "fake tibiantis" with 0 players online, right?

you just can't accept the fact we DON'T want to be on your list, period.
Lul, is it me who started talking about your server or you talking about my list? You fail to accept that I really, really, really don't care about your server.
Post automatically merged:

I do not believe somebody would try to put tibiantis on otservlist that's not involed with this (xinn/torg users to troll kay) <- pick one
On beta stage, discord, PM msg'es, there [otland] and their forum he was spamming he will never use your list
Also sharing the same statement with @Ahilphino damn. You must really visit this forum once a year to not know such people like @Ahilphino and even agree with his msg'es

If that changes something in your life, a guy named "GM Lolus" added it to the list ;)
 
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If that was a true, your server wouldn't be shown on otservlist
We never used any status protocol or other thing compatible with your list. I believie, that your server is just knocking to 7171/7172 (or other tibia-like ports) if it's open it fails when parsing response and then just displays 0
 
Why you think it's about me wanting to judge your server or not. Why would I wait 9 months if only what I cared for was "judging a server which doesn't care about otservlist". Why not earlier? I wrote why I wrote that post - I've received many questions about your server so instead of replying to everyone it was more efficient to write one public post.
Alright, people were asking you. So instead of telling them that Medivia was removed on Iryont's own request - which is the truth, as you have confirmed yourself in the very same post I am quoting now, here:
I completely have no problem with that (which has been proven by for example, removing medivia on requst from the list).
You actually told people this:
There is a lot of people asking me about Medivia privately so I decided to address this once for all.
You are right. Medivia was removed from otservlist because they didn't want to follow that rule Very important - Rules change on otservlist.org.

Medivia's number of players online then wasn't really real. Most of the people were running huge rune-maker farms and that's probably why they didn't want to follow a new rule and was eventually removed from the list. At that time I even received a screenshot from a guy who was running over 50 multi clients to create runes for his main character...

Again, cause I'm not sure you're able to comprehend it at first time. Iryont asked you to remove Medivia from the list, which you did. People were asking you why it wasn't present on the list, and you decided to answer. But instead of telling them it was his decision, you said that it was removed because they "didn't want to follow your rules, probably because of their huge farms".

Wait, what?

Again, you remove Medivia from the list on their own request. People ask you why it's removed, and you feel the urge to answer. But you don't tell them it's removed out of Iryont's free will. You tell them it's removed because of your rules and their farms.

Now back to my case:
If that was a true, your server wouldn't be shown on otservlist (instead, it would be shown as offline), but we talked about an online "fake tibiantis" with 0 players online, right?
I know for a fact we never had that protocol there. We don't use any public distro that would come with it. And I don't care if it was our real IP or not, and if it showed 0 online or offline on your website. We just did not want it there, and I kindly asked you to remove it. Which you did (I never denied it), but you also said that it might re-appear and you wouldn't ban it, because we weren't using the list. So the solution would be us adding our server there. You said it straight.

Not only you tried to make me add it by this dirty move, but you have also proven you didn't care about your list reliability at all, cause you didn't give a damn about fake/invalid entries that your users might come across.

So that was the first time you disrespected our decision of not using the list. The second time was just now, when you signed this statement:
stop acting like you dont want your server on otservlist
it would be obvious to anyone it cant be listed there when its 90% afk macroing runemakers


Lul, is it me who started talking about your server or you talking about my list? You fail to accept that I really, really, really don't care about your.
It is you who makes public statements based purely on your asumptions as to why some servers don't want to use your list, as shown above.
 
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Alright, people were asking you. So instead of telling them that Medivia was removed on Iryont's own request - which is the truth, as you have confirmed yourself in the very same post I am quoting now, here:

You actually told people this:


Again, cause I'm not sure you're able to comprehend it at first time. Iryont asked you to remove Medivia from the list, which you did. People were asking you why it wasn't present on the list, and you decided to answer. But instead of telling them it was his decision, you said that it was removed because they "didn't want to follow your rules, probably because of their huge farms".

Wait, what?

Again, you remove Medivia from the list on their own request. People ask you why it's removed, and you feel the urge to answer. But you don't tell them it's removed out of Iryont's free will. You tell them it's removed because of your rules and their farms.

Hello, mr. Goebbels.

Now back to my case:

I know for a fact we never had that protocol there. We don't use any public distro that would come with it. And I don't care if it was our real IP or not, and if it showed 0 online or offline on your website. We just did not want it there, and I kindly asked you to remove it. Which you did (I never denied it), but you also said that it might re-appear and you wouldn't ban it, because we weren't using the list. So the solution would be us adding our server there. You said it straight.

Not only you tried to make me add it by this dirty move, but you have also proven you didn't care about your list reliability at all, cause you didn't give a damn about fake/invalid entries.

So that was the first time you disrespected our decision of not using the list. The second time was just now, when you signed this statement:

Oh, it's you - mr. Goebbels, again.


It is you who makes public statements based purely on your asumptions as to why some servers don't want to use your list, as shown above.
You impress me.
 
My experience with @xinn:

Got banned 2 times on otlist:

The first one was a complaint 2 years ago made by someone, and Xinn made a full review asking for files, opened proccess on system and a fix on protocol status. After this review server was unbanned.

The second was about new update on protocolstatus for unique players that I didn't update. After fixed, server was unbanned again.

So, WITH ME everytime he was fair and honest, and otservlist.org is a legacy from Open Tibia world. I used it since I was a child looking for servers to play.
 
My experience with @xinn:

Got banned 2 times on otlist:

The first one was a complaint 2 years ago made by someone, and Xinn made a full review asking for files, opened proccess on system and a fix on protocol status. After this review server was unbanned.

The second was about new update on protocolstatus for unique players that I didn't update. After fixed, server was unbanned again.

So, WITH ME everytime he was fair and honest, and otservlist.org is a legacy from Open Tibia world. I used it since I was a child looking for servers to play.

Do server owners give away our data to a guy just like that without even any data entrustment agreements?
wow.
 
xD I don't believe

unknown.png

LnH1PLa.png

so @kay was banned for ironically saying "mr. Goebbels", when he did that only because xinn called him "Goebbels" in his posts before? XD so why isn't xinn banned too? especially when he said it first?


xDD

I assume it was for "Goebbels" cause I saw the original post and now it's edited by moderator, where the only difference is someone removed "Goebbels"
but in xinn post you can still see he called kay and Iryont that XD


xDDDDDDDD
 
Imaginary world ;) Goebells would be proud of you. Again, you keep making those statements, so enlighten me, if you didn't want to be on the list, why you've added your server to the list 2 years~ later? You try to distort the history. How does it benefit you? Take a look at this screenshot, just to remind you the imaginary time, when a big man who didn't care about the list back in that time, didn't want to be on it... added it anyway... ;) Unfortunately medivia was automatically removed and we never really talked again.

I'm afraid I don't remember doing such thing and our last conversation was in 2017 as you can check yourself on the email archive, therefore by paraphrasing your words I can only answer that it can be faked. Regarding the rest, I believe Kay said more than enough explaining your inability to actually comprehend the issue. There is no point in continuing this discussion or me wasting even more time.

On a side note, Kay was banished and someone edited his post removing "mr. goebbels", yet it is still in Xinn's post since Kay was paraphrasing his own words. All I can say is that you guys are a disgrace to Open Tibia legacy. What a mess it became.
 
xD I don't believe

unknown.png

LnH1PLa.png

so @kay was banned for ironically saying "mr. Goebbels", when he did that only because xinn called him "Goebbels" in his posts before? XD so why isn't xinn banned too? especially when he said it first?


xDD

I assume it was for "Goebbels" cause I saw the original post and now it's edited by moderator, where the only difference is someone removed "Goebbels"
but in xinn post you can still see he called kay and Iryont that XD


xDDDDDDDD
Have you considered there's a warning system? I would assume probably kay had some prior warning points, and the warning he received now pushed him over the automatic ban threshold. I'd also assume that xinn would have received the same warning, with the difference being that he didn't have any prior warning points, or at least not enough to automatically get banned.

Just my guess tho
 
xD I don't believe

unknown.png

LnH1PLa.png

so @kay was banned for ironically saying "mr. Goebbels", when he did that only because xinn called him "Goebbels" in his posts before? XD so why isn't xinn banned too? especially when he said it first?


xDD

I assume it was for "Goebbels" cause I saw the original post and now it's edited by moderator, where the only difference is someone removed "Goebbels"
but in xinn post you can still see he called kay and Iryont that XD


xDDDDDDDD

Remember to report Xinn for saying that someone is MR Gobels which is against rule #6.

Paul Joseph Goebbels (pronounced [ˈpaʊ̯l ˈjoːzɛf ˈɡœbl̩s] (listen); 29 October 1897 – 1 May 1945) was a German Nazi politician who was the Gauleiter (district leader) of Berlin, chief propagandist for the Nazi Party, and then Reich Minister of Propaganda from 1933 to 1945. He was one of Adolf Hitler's closest and most devoted acolytes, known for his skills in public speaking and his deeply virulent antisemitism, which was evident in his publicly voiced views. He advocated progressively harsher discrimination, including the extermination of the Jews in the Holocaust.

I was told on PM by a moderator (@Kaspar ) that they do not cooperate with scammers [XD] (not promoting scams) - I hope you also do not cooperate with people promoting personas non grata and offending other users' ad persona. :)
 

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Have you considered there's a warning system? I would assume probably kay had some prior warning points, and the warning he received now pushed him over the automatic ban threshold. I'd also assume that xinn would have received the same warning, with the difference being that he didn't have any prior warning points, or at least not enough to automatically get banned.

Just my guess tho
Yeah, seems like quoting is banable xD
og post of xinn, which Kay quoted wasn't editied so whats the matter
 
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