Discussion about websites is criminal

[JeiDi]

I wanted to share my project with the community today and create a discussion about it, but it turned out that discussing websites related to Open Tibia is illegal on this forum (it seems only in certain cases*).

This is stated in point 4 of the rules, namely:
"Website advertisement, as in creating a thread with the intention to advertise another website, is not allowed."
For some reason, we cannot talk about projects related to Open Tibia (that are not servers) on the largest forum dedicated to Open Tibia. It feels like the rules here are applied selectively, depending on who posts or what project it is, which raises questions about fairness and consistency. Therefore, I would like to start a discussion about whether this benefits the small community by trying to kill projects that aim to help this environment by point 4 of the rules.

What do you think about this rule?
Of course, I’m raising this topic because I was directly affected by it, but the discussion could be helpful for everyone.

*I mentioned "in certain cases" because otservlist is not only advertised on this forum but also has its own subforum here: Otservlist Discussion (https://otland.net/forums/otservlist-discussion.451/). Additionally, it seems that some other websites have not only their own threads but also threads that are not discussions but purely promotional, for example,
OTS Hosting Service supports high-quality servers (https://otland.net/threads/ots-hosting-service-supports-high-quality-servers.173176/
A servers list that stores players (https://otland.net/threads/a-servers-list-that-stores-players.282014/)
https://otland.net/threads/yourgamingdude-the-new-open-tibia-servers-list.265021/
Tibian - An OTServ List for 2020 (https://otland.net/threads/tibian-an-otserv-list-for-2020.269641/page-3)
Tibia Live - Open Tibia Server List [work in progress] (https://otland.net/threads/tibia-live-open-tibia-server-list-work-in-progress.262321/)

 

[Gesior.pl]

For some reason, we cannot talk about projects related to Open Tibia (that are not servers) on the largest forum dedicated to Open Tibia

IDK.

If your project is "OTS" that will start now/soon, you are able to post it in: Server Gala (https://otland.net/forums/server-gala.43/) ( [BOARD RULES] Read this before posting (https://otland.net/threads/board-rules-read-this-before-posting.126558/) ), but it's your project, not Open Tibia.

If your OTS is just an idea (ex. "what do you like on evo servers/canary/TFS?"), no domain/name to start it. You can talk about it on Discussion board.

In "Open Tibia", Open is related to open-source. So, if you are interested in sharing your server/client source code as TFS does ( GitHub - otland/forgottenserver: A free and open-source MMORPG server emulator written in C++ (https://github.com/otland/forgottenserver) ), it's fine, but if you plan to talk about 'your server' and then start 'your private' server (OTS) on your own domain, it's not "open tibia" thread and it will be probably banned on OTLand.

 

[JeiDi]

IDK.

If your project is "OTS" that will start now/soon, you are able to post it in: Server Gala (https://otland.net/forums/server-gala.43/) ( [BOARD RULES] Read this before posting (https://otland.net/threads/board-rules-read-this-before-posting.126558/) ), but it's your project, not Open Tibia.

If your OTS is just an idea (ex. "what do you like on evo servers/canary/TFS?"), no domain/name to start it. You can talk about it on Discussion board.

In "Open Tibia", Open is related to open-source. So, if you are interested in sharing your server/client source code as TFS does ( GitHub - otland/forgottenserver: A free and open-source MMORPG server emulator written in C++ (https://github.com/otland/forgottenserver) ), it's fine, but if you plan to talk about 'your server' and then start 'your private' server (OTS) on your own domain, it's not "open tibia" thread and it will be probably banned on OTLand.

It is a website related to OTS [open tibia servers], not an OTS itself - that's why I linked other threads that are actively advertising websites (OT related) on Otland.

It's advertised anyway in my signature, but a thread to discuss it cannot be created (well...)

 

[Kaspar]

I wanted to share my project with the community today and create a discussion about it, but it turned out that discussing websites related to Open Tibia is illegal on this forum (it seems only in certain cases*).

This is stated in point 4 of the rules, namely:
"Website advertisement, as in creating a thread with the intention to advertise another website, is not allowed."
For some reason, we cannot talk about projects related to Open Tibia (that are not servers) on the largest forum dedicated to Open Tibia. It feels like the rules here are applied selectively, depending on who posts or what project it is, which raises questions about fairness and consistency. Therefore, I would like to start a discussion about whether this benefits the small community by trying to kill projects that aim to help this environment by point 4 of the rules.

What do you think about this rule?
Of course, I’m raising this topic because I was directly affected by it, but the discussion could be helpful for everyone.

*I mentioned "in certain cases" because otservlist is not only advertised on this forum but also has its own subforum here: Otservlist Discussion (https://otland.net/forums/otservlist-discussion.451/). Additionally, it seems that some other websites have not only their own threads but also threads that are not discussions but purely promotional, for example,
OTS Hosting Service supports high-quality servers (https://otland.net/threads/ots-hosting-service-supports-high-quality-servers.173176/
A servers list that stores players (https://otland.net/threads/a-servers-list-that-stores-players.282014/)
https://otland.net/threads/yourgamingdude-the-new-open-tibia-servers-list.265021/
Tibian - An OTServ List for 2020 (https://otland.net/threads/tibian-an-otserv-list-for-2020.269641/page-3)
Tibia Live - Open Tibia Server List [work in progress] (https://otland.net/threads/tibia-live-open-tibia-server-list-work-in-progress.262321/)


View attachment 88768

There is nothing criminal about it. Your thread did however break our site's rules.

It's common to feel that the authoritarian laws are unfair and selectively enforced when they directly affect you.
Last time I got a speeding ticket I asked the cop why he didn't give tickets to everyone else that were also clearly speeding. He just looked at me with a weird look on his face, almost as if he was expecting me to whip out a cloning gadget from my pocket to help him apply the rules everywhere.
Unfortunately I didn't have such a device, and we moved on with our lives. This is why I asked you to help us moderate the forum better by reporting any thread you think is breaking the rules -- which you did by the way, thank you. (The cop story is obviously fake, I don't drive recklessly).

It is true that we generally do not allow any website advertisement at all. However, due to historical discussions, we do allow Open Tibia server list Discussion-threads (evidently by the posts you have linked). I think it's more than fair to let people share their OTS-lists, and have this as an exception to the "no website advertisement is allowed"-rule. Most people here agree with that as well.

One of the links you've shared is not about an OTS-list, but rather about a hosting service, which is explicitly allowed per rule 11.
All the other Discussion threads about unique Open Tibia server lists were within the scope of being part of the exception mentioned above.

tl;dr
Your website contains a tab called "OT Marketplace" and soon apparently also a tab called "OT Resources". This is where we draw the line, commerce of resources is not allowed and that is why your website Discussion thread was not part of the same exception as OTS-lists usually are. Having links in one's signature is generally allowed, but in your case it's not. So I will have to ask you to remove that signature.

 

[JeiDi]

There is nothing criminal about it. Your thread did however break our site's rules.

It's common to feel that the authoritarian laws are unfair and selectively enforced when they directly affect you.
Last time I got a speeding ticket I asked the cop why he didn't give tickets to everyone else that were also clearly speeding. He just looked at me with a weird look on his face, almost as if he was expecting me to whip out a cloning gadget from my pocket to help him apply the rules everywhere.
Unfortunately I didn't have such a device, and we moved on with our lives. This is why I asked you to help us moderate the forum better by reporting any thread you think is breaking the rules -- which you did by the way, thank you. (The cop story is obviously fake, I don't drive recklessly).

It is true that we generally do not allow any website advertisement at all. However, due to historical discussions, we do allow Open Tibia server list Discussion-threads (evidently by the posts you have linked). I think it's more than fair to let people share their OTS-lists, and have this as an exception to the "no website advertisement is allowed"-rule. Most people here agree with that as well.

One of the links you've shared is not about an OTS-list, but rather about a hosting service, which is explicitly allowed per rule 11.
All the other Discussion threads about unique Open Tibia server lists were within the scope of being part of the exception mentioned above.

tl;dr
Your website contains a tab called "OT Marketplace" and soon apparently also a tab called "OT Resources". This is where we draw the line, commerce of resources is not allowed and that is why your website Discussion thread was not part of the same exception as OTS-lists usually are. Having links in one's signature is generally allowed, but in your case it's not. So I will have to ask you to remove that signature.

I have no legal rights to sell or allow the selling of Tibia Clients or IP Changers, which are free. Isn't it trying to punish me for something that is not on the website? You can click these links to see the content.

And since the OTS list is allowed, why isn't that stated in the rules as with the OT hosting?

My site is OTS List, as that's a feature that is working there. Does it mean you made a mistake, and I can repost it? If it makes you/other moderators calm, I can remove these links in the footer that are not working called "Tibia CipSoft Clients" and "Tibia IP Changers" (however, other OTS Lists that you are actively promoting have the exact same subpages (downloadable IP changes and links to clients) on their pages, and it seems to be OK.

 

[Kaspar]

If the (unfinished) OT Resources tab is not for selling resources then it's fine.
You still have the OT Marketplace which will prevent you from advertising your website.

I adjusted the rule to clearly state that having a Discussion thread about your Open Tibia Server list is fine as long as it complies with our rules.