Modules

[lord vortexx]

think we can use the Molebox not get the desired result, because besides being easy decryption I believe that it does not compress folders.

 

[BeniS]

There is no advantage to players in having the modules.
If you want to 'hide' all your module logic, then learn C++/otclient framework and build it into the source that way.

Personally I think its silly to want to hide away these things.

 

[Dante_]

Random Server Owner using OT Client: Oh look, another server with an insane amount of customization in the modules of it's OTClient! -copies and pastes all the modules- Now I have an amazing customized OTClient too!

Random Server Player: Oh, I don't like this, let me see if I can screw with the modules! -mixes something up and sends new packets to the server- Oops! I debugged my client/Oops! I debugged the server!

There's A LOT of reasons to want to hide modules... .-.

 

[Summ]

Why would that be your buisiness?
If a player decides to trash his own client he may do so. He will have no advantages if the server side is correctly set up.

 

[edubart]

There's A LOT of reasons to want to hide modules... .-.

Otclient is an opensource project, it's goal for the project to get every developer or even players that uses it helping out the project, with contribution from everyone we can achieve a great client for everyone, not just for you, this kind of thought is too selfish. The fact you want to take a whole project made by hours of work from other people and the first thing you think is to lock down all scripts to hide any minor change is kinda rude and pointless, you would be hiding 99% of our open source work which is already out there. Wanting to have just your client to be better than the others in reality would just give more work for you, we gave an amazing client for free and it's fair to deserve something back from you and the community, what we want is contributions and you can do these in two ways, directly in our codebase or by customizing the client for your server while the changes is visible then the main project could benefit from these changes. So the fact that you can't hide the code is a good thing for this project goal, we would like to keep that way so we discourage any change or help that could lock down the otclient scripts. I am not saying that you can't, just saying this is "forbidden" for us, including in this forum.

Random Server Owner using OT Client: Oh look, another server with an insane amount of customization in the modules of it's OTClient! -copies and pastes all the modules- Now I have an amazing customized OTClient too!

Copying just the client is not the same of copying your game, what makes your game is the stuff behind, the server. The client is just an interface to a game, what matters is behind.

Random Server Player: Oh, I don't like this, let me see if I can screw with the modules! -mixes something up and sends new packets to the server- Oops! I debugged my client/Oops! I debugged the server!

Player messing with the client is a good thing, they can improve your game for you, thus less work for you. More than that they will share improvements with each other and more the players of your game will be happier. Take as example WoW, the client core is surely not opensource, but there are tons of modules to help ingame and change the game interface, players care about that alot, it's hard to find a real wow player that doesn't use addons, which are made in lua too and this is a not a concidence, the idea of players creating modules in otclient for the game was taken from WoW.

If you insist in this idea please do not ask us or on this forum, you are alone on this. Even if you try alone, there will always be a way to break down and get the scripts, would be a work in vain.

 

[Xenios]

I agree with Edubart. People who think like the post from Aziz are selfish, not being honest/fair and only want things and not give things so only they get the best of the best if not just earning money, sure some competition is always needed, but when using somebody else's work you should in return give something back like sharing your modules or piece of C++ code and support. The developers of OTClient just like the TFS, OpenTibia team they have put countless of hours and work in it to make the project accessible to everyone in the hope that the project itself will benefit from contributions, so some people that I was speaking off are somewhat destroying this idea which is open source.

Luckily there are people who do want to contribute or let other people use their work and I admire these people for their work.

 

[Fabri]

I agree with Edubart. People who think like the post from Aziz are selfish, not being honest/fair and only want things and not give things so only they get the best of the best if not just earning money, sure some competition is always needed, but when using somebody else's work you should in return give something back like sharing your modules or piece of C++ code and support. The developers of OTClient just like the TFS, OpenTibia team they have put countless of hours and work in it to make the project accessible to everyone in the hope that the project itself will benefit from contributions, so some people that I was speaking off are somewhat destroying this idea which is open source.

Luckily there are people who do want to contribute or let other people use their work and I admire these people for their work.

I agree.

Our company is developing a 100% custom comercial game under TFS+Otclient plataform and we will provide to entire community all custom modules that we will develop.

 

[Dante_]

I am all for sharing hard work with other coders and people who contribute, but I am not one to sympathize with leeches. 99.5% of all servers out to-date are download and run servers with a few scripts grabbed off the resource threads. Absolutely no work is put in by the owners and then they get the praise; and they get tons of money out of their donations.

As for claiming I'm selfish; I've helped a ton of leechers with their scripts, I released: http://otland.net/f82/addon-bonus-system-67961/ and then a more cleaner and customizable version: http://otland.net/f82/outfit-addons-stats-system-150072/

Amongst many fixes, many support requests and helped countless people who have added me outside of OTLand and within OTLand private messages.

I am far from selfish, I just appreciate the idea that some things should be unique as opposed to every server being a download and run server.

As for your response Edubart; I am all for helping out and giving out modules, I just don't want everyone to take specific ideas and claim them as their own. That would be like me taking OTClient, changing one word and then calling it my own creation; it would be a lie, it would make me a thief, and it would then have made all your hard work in vain to some because they will think I created it.

I'm not saying I don't want to help or share, I just don't want to give out anything to leeches.

Edit: Just re-read Xenios response and realized; you just called me selfish for wanting to keep some of my work to myself. Alright then. That's like calling Blizzard selfish for not giving out the source code to their game which hundreds of coders were paid to make.

Edit (cont'd): Anywho, I plan to look into hiding modules but keeping mods available. If I do figure it out, I will share it with those who believe that there is such a thing as leeches out there.

Edit (cont'd): And to everyone who calls me selfish, you are also calling Remere; the creator of Remere's Map Editor and a majority of Open Tibia selfish. Because he completely agreed with me that modules shouldn't be freely available and he also had worked on a way of hiding the modules.

 

[BeniS]

I am all for sharing hard work with other coders and people who contribute, but I am not one to sympathize with leeches. 99.5% of all servers out to-date are download and run servers with a few scripts grabbed off the resource threads. Absolutely no work is put in by the owners and then they get the praise; and they get tons of money out of their donations.

As for claiming I'm selfish; I've helped a ton of leechers with their scripts, I released: http://otland.net/f82/addon-bonus-system-67961/ and then a more cleaner and customizable version: http://otland.net/f82/outfit-addons-stats-system-150072/

Amongst many fixes, many support requests and helped countless people who have added me outside of OTLand and within OTLand private messages.

I am far from selfish, I just appreciate the idea that some things should be unique as opposed to every server being a download and run server.

As for your response Edubart; I am all for helping out and giving out modules, I just don't want everyone to take specific ideas and claim them as their own. That would be like me taking OTClient, changing one word and then calling it my own creation; it would be a lie, it would make me a thief, and it would then have made all your hard work in vain to some because they will think I created it.

I'm not saying I don't want to help or share, I just don't want to give out anything to leeches.

Edit: Just re-read Xenios response and realized; you just called me selfish for wanting to keep some of my work to myself. Alright then. That's like calling Blizzard selfish for not giving out the source code to their game which hundreds of coders were paid to make.

Edit (cont'd): Anywho, I plan to look into hiding modules but keeping mods available. If I do figure it out, I will share it with those who believe that there is such a thing as leeches out there.

Edit (cont'd): And to everyone who calls me selfish, you are also calling Remere; the creator of Remere's Map Editor and a majority of Open Tibia selfish. Because he completely agreed with me that modules shouldn't be freely available and he also had worked on a way of hiding the modules.

Hidden modules are not the mentality that we want to be having with otclient, so it won't be released by us. If you want to hide the modules then you are free to do that, but we aren't going to help with that.

I am far from selfish, I just appreciate the idea that some things should be unique as opposed to every server being a download and run server.

I can appreciate this. I suggest that if you are designing something unique that you do it in such a way that it isn't critical when they move the module over to their otclient.

I'm not saying I don't want to help or share, I just don't want to give out anything to leeches.

But you are being allowed to leech from us? Why is your module work so much more important?

Edit: Just re-read Xenios response and realized; you just called me selfish for wanting to keep some of my work to myself. Alright then. That's like calling Blizzard selfish for not giving out the source code to their game which hundreds of coders were paid to make.

Modules shouldn't be as critical as the source code. If it is, then I suggest moving it into the source.

Edit (cont'd): Anywho, I plan to look into hiding modules but keeping mods available. If I do figure it out, I will share it with those who believe that there is such a thing as leeches out there.

If it is so critical that you don't want it to be taken and used by other people, then build it into the source code. If you are not able to do this, then stop using otclient and figure out another way to customize a client (or leech it off someone else ).

Also to be honest a vast majority of Open Tibia is all about making money now, so yes I would be calling a majority of Open Tibia selfish, but I'm not calling you nor Remere selfish.

Not really sure why you are saying this though:

you are also calling Remere; the creator of Remere's Map Editor and a majority of Open Tibia selfish

Remere's map editor isn't even open source any more. Great release don't get me wrong, but not open source for the community. Naturally that would mean his mentality is to hide modules, etc. Or maybe I am wrong, that is just my impression about it.

 

[Dante_]

Hidden modules are not the mentality that we want to be having with otclient, so it won't be released by us. If you want to hide the modules then you are free to do that, but we aren't going to help with that.



I can appreciate this. I suggest that if you are designing something unique that you do it in such a way that it isn't critical when they move the module over to their otclient.



But you are being allowed to leech from us? Why is your module work so much more important?



We aren't being paid to develop this and release it to anyone. Also modules shouldn't be as critical as the source code. If it is, then I suggest moving it into the source.



If it is so critical that you don't want it to be taken and used by other people, then build it into the source code. If you are not able to do this, then stop using otclient and figure out another way to customize a client (or leech it off someone else ).

Also to be honest a vast majority of Open Tibia is all about making money now, so yes I would be calling a majority of Open Tibia selfish, but I'm not calling you nor Remere selfish.

Not really sure why you are saying this though:

Remere's map editor isn't even open source any more. Great release don't get me wrong, but not open source for the community. Naturally that would mean his mentality is to hide modules, etc. Or maybe I am wrong, that is just my impression about it.

Sorry I'm not going to go as in depth, but you actually stated it in a very fair way. I can completely respect why you don't want to hide the modules, and your points are very valid. Thank you for actually taking the time to respond with something reasonable and informative.

But yes, I do agree, I am also a leech in the sense that I am using the TFS source and the OTClient source, but I am not creating servers for income, I am creating them to make fun servers that do nothing more than pay for the hosting, and that's only if I don't have a steady job, otherwise I don't plan to accept donations.

And the only reason I shared the Remere thing is because OTServ and RevScript were strongly contributed to by Remere, and if I'm not mistaken, he created RevScript. Same with the map editor being open source, I'm fairly certain it still is, he just doesn't want anything to do with Tibia anymore, so he's simply updating the map editor without worrying about releasing the source since he's just giving working copies at this point.

But ya, I get the adding it to source part, which I did. Only thing that's not in source is a few of the much needed edits. I'm just going to look into locking modules, though I understand why OTClient creators won't support the idea.

 

[Exedion]

I dont whant hide modules of otclient, but i whant hide all dev buttons like console, modules and all "visual" access to these features and put in options or another place, why? because is more eye candy to normal user...

 

[edubart]

I dont whant hide modules of otclient, but i whant hide all dev buttons like console, modules and all "visual" access to these features and put in options or another place, why? because is more eye candy to normal user...

This is simple, just don't load them, by removing these lines from modules/client/client.otmod
- client_terminal
- client_modulemanager

 

[Baxnie]

There's no need to hide modules.
Bot protection do not allow modules to send anything to server if it is not from an user input.
Also, otclient is flexible already, so copying a module without having the sources is pretty easy.

 

[XPRIMEX]

Why people want to hide their files? The main advantage of keeping everything open-source is that eveyone can contribute and create something better. More people = faster development. BTW there's no way to make files 100% secured. .Dat and .Spr can be edited easily, aren't them? Now look at most of the other games, nearly every file security system has been broken.

If someone will want to steal your sprites, or anything else he will find a way. Making screenshots for example.

acttuallly. when a item is in game tibia did a smart thing they appear as if they zoomed in just a tad making them the wrong size and quality. Sir

 

[eduardowm]

Otclient is an opensource project, it's goal for the project to get every developer or even players that uses it helping out the project, with contribution from everyone we can achieve a great client for everyone, not just for you, this kind of thought is too selfish. The fact you want to take a whole project made by hours of work from other people and the first thing you think is to lock down all scripts to hide any minor change is kinda rude and pointless, you would be hiding 99% of our open source work which is already out there. Wanting to have just your client to be better than the others in reality would just give more work for you, we gave an amazing client for free and it's fair to deserve something back from you and the community, what we want is contributions and you can do these in two ways, directly in our codebase or by customizing the client for your server while the changes is visible then the main project could benefit from these changes. So the fact that you can't hide the code is a good thing for this project goal, we would like to keep that way so we discourage any change or help that could lock down the otclient scripts. I am not saying that you can't, just saying this is "forbidden" for us, including in this forum.



Copying just the client is not the same of copying your game, what makes your game is the stuff behind, the server. The client is just an interface to a game, what matters is behind.


Player messing with the client is a good thing, they can improve your game for you, thus less work for you. More than that they will share improvements with each other and more the players of your game will be happier. Take as example WoW, the client core is surely not opensource, but there are tons of modules to help ingame and change the game interface, players care about that alot, it's hard to find a real wow player that doesn't use addons, which are made in lua too and this is a not a concidence, the idea of players creating modules in otclient for the game was taken from WoW.

If you insist in this idea please do not ask us or on this forum, you are alone on this. Even if you try alone, there will always be a way to break down and get the scripts, would be a work in vain.

Why you hide PxG files so? lol

 

[Summ]

Why you hide PxG files so? lol

Who said that it is his server?

 

[eduardowm]

I did not say he owns the server.
The information that I have is that he works for them, the owners themselves who said it publicly. Among other things, saying that PxG is the creator of the OTClient project.

I do not want to accuse anyone of anything, the project is wonderful and everyone should thank him for it. But some things need to be clarified...

 

[Printer]

I did not say he owns the server.
The information that I have is that he works for them, the owners themselves who said it publicly. Among other things, saying that PxG is the creator of the OTClient project.

I do not want to accuse anyone of anything, the project is wonderful and everyone should thank him for it. But some things need to be clarified...

Well maybe they made a deal with Edubart!

 

[Keru]

lol, such an small brain you have eduardowm, they must say who create it, but they are entailed to change/edit the client.
Ex.
If I'm a DJ. and i used a song from xxXX guys, if i don't want to have any problem legal wise, i must say song of xxXX mix by yyYY.

or something similar. Maybe I'm wrong and Edubart, did help develop their client, but he is not entitled to give you the files he work hard to make it. Quit bitching and start writing your own programs Edubart already did way to much by realizing and keep developing such an amazing Open Client

 

[eduardowm]

lol, such an small brain you have eduardowm, they must say who create it, but they are entailed to change/edit the client.
Ex.
If I'm a DJ. and i used a song from xxXX guys, if i don't want to have any problem legal wise, i must say song of xxXX mix by yyYY.

or something similar. Maybe I'm wrong and Edubart, did help develop their client, but he is not entitled to give you the files he work hard to make it. Quit bitching and start writing your own programs Edubart already did way to much by realizing and keep developing such an amazing Open Client

I'll skip the part where you were rude.
Obviously they are not required to provide their files, I don't care about it. I'm just questioning the message that he says one thing and does another.