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Reward Chest

Elwyn

Well-Known Member
Joined
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Hello, OTLanders
I'm one step away from pushing the Reward Chest to Chaotic Server (link) and would like to ask for suggestions about the algorithm to split the loot.

As of now, the algorithm consist of:
Giving points to players who heal, receive damage and deal damage to certain monsters.
Loot rate is then increased by a factor based on contribution: (1 + points/totalpoints) * server_loot_rate
Each person will generate a loot using the loot rate calculated above.

Now, what I want to ask you guys is: What's a fair way to distribute points? How much does receiving damage gives points? ratio of 1 dmg per 1 point? Is giving one bross drop per person with loot rate 1 plus contribution too much?
Let me hear what you guys think :)
 
Q1: I think that it all depends on how much points a player receives from doing damage and healing. I would say that taking damage gives more points then the other two since taking damage is more risky then healing or doing damage, especially in a boss fight.

Q2: Yes, too much. I think that this will be abused a lot. I would suggest that you don't give any loot to players that is too inactive on boss fights or else players will bring many ghost characters just to get extra mega loot.

Hope it helps. :)
 
%based - amount of total damage dealt to boss
- amount of total damage taken from boss
- amount of total healing in the boss fight
With damage taken>healing done>damage done
 
Q1: I think that it all depends on how much points a player receives from doing damage and healing. I would say that taking damage gives more points then the other two since taking damage is more risky then healing or doing damage, especially in a boss fight.

Q2: Yes, too much. I think that this will be abused a lot. I would suggest that you don't give any loot to players that is too inactive on boss fights or else players will bring many ghost characters just to get extra mega loot.

Hope it helps. :)

Q1: I was thinking that too. One suggestion I got from another forum was 1/5 ratio for heal and attack damage, and 1/1 ratio for tanking. I think that would be quite fair for the tanker as he's in the position with the most risk of all.

Q2: True, I didn't think of that. It should be contribution points * loot rate, then.
 
About healing done, make sure it's actually is healing done, not healing spells casted to player with full health. If this is not controlled, ghost characters will simply spam healing on themselves and get loot.
 
About healing done, make sure it's actually is healing done, not healing spells casted to player with full health. If this is not controlled, ghost characters will simply spam healing on themselves and get loot.
I didn't think of that too. You sure have an evil mind for abusing, Trollebror! hahahaha
 
Add another check to see if players get above a certain threshold.
If 14 people are obtaining loot, if all players are within 5% of each other, rolls for loot are equal.
People healing may have less risk, but they also are an important part of the team and shouldn't be neglected on loot drops because they are not taking damage or doing damage.
Healing points should be raised.

0.85/1 tanking
1/1 healing
1/1 damage.

Boss has lot's of hp, so tank's get free points the longer the battle. They also get to deal damage.
Damage dealers, have to go through all of that health, but their damage will be higher to compensate.
Healing the tank is a necessary part of the team, and if failed will squad wipe. If they are able to do damage as well, great, but not needed.

Boss hp 8700
Boss hits 100 dmg per 2 seconds.
Boss takes 2 minutes to kill.

Tank is able to deal 25 dmg per 2 seconds.
Healer is able to heal the tank to full every 2 seconds. Can deal 40 damage every 4 turns. (1 turn = 2 seconds)
Damager dealer is able to hit 110 dmg per 2 seconds.

Outcome,
Tank get's hit 100 * 60, 6000 dmg. 5100 points.
Tank deals, 25 * 60 dmg, 1500 dmg. 1500 points.
Tank get's 6600 points.

Healer heals tank 100 dmg * 60, = 6000 damage, 6000 points
healer deals 40 * 15 dmg = 600 dmg. 600 points
Healer get's 6600 points.

Damager hits 110 * 60 dmg. 6600 dmg.
Damager get's 6600 points.


Using the above combination and roughly keeping the boss hp about 90x the damage the boss can deal, the stats should be roughly the same for all active party members.

--edit.

Remember hp will always need to go higher, because there are usually more damage dealers, and of course more dealers then tanks..

If 7 dmg dealers, 2 tanks and 3 healers..
The stats are gonna get messed up pretty bad.
The boss will die quicker, less dmg to tanks.. which means 2 things
Tanks' get more points, because health lost is lower.
Healers get less points because less health being lost.
Damage dealers get less points because of quantity of damagers.

Let's try the above.

Same boss.

Damage dealers deal 6600 damage per 2 minutes.
So roughly 1/7th of the time this time.
942 points per damager.

Tanks get hit 100 * 17 = 1700 hp. 1445 points
They deal 25 * 8 = 200 dmg, 200 points.
Tank get 1645 points.

Healers heal 1700 hp * 2 / 3.. 1133 points
healers deal 40 * 2 dmg = 80 points
1214 points.

See how the points got messed up?

There has to be a better system in place then a point system.. or change the points based on some parameters.

A better point system would count how active you are during a fight, and give a little extra points for your level.

For every 50 levels, gain 1 point per 10 seconds.
Have you been damaged within the past 10 seconds? 1.1 points.
Are you dealing damage equal to 4x your characters level within the past 10 seconds? 1.1 points.
Are you dealing damage less then double your character level within the past 10 seconds? 0.2 points.
Are you healing somebody other then yourself within the past 10 seconds? 0.9 points.

2 minute battle excluding level.

Tank get's 13.2 points for taking damage.
Tank get's 2.4 points for dealing damage.
15.6 points.

Healer get's 10.8 points for healing.
Healer get's 2.4 points for doing damage.
Healer was damaged twice. 2.2 points.
15.4 points.

Damager get's 13.2 points for dealing damage.
Got damaged twice. 2.2 points
15.4 points.

Abusing the above system can be done by taking extra damage then you are supposed to in your position.
Add another check.
If they have received the healer/damager points within the past 30 seconds then check next.
If they have received the damaging point within the past 60 seconds, they are unable to receive those points.

Idk.. just rambling at this point.

Good luck. :P
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Add another check to see if players get above a certain threshold.
If 14 people are obtaining loot, if all players are within 5% of each other, rolls for loot are equal.
People healing may have less risk, but they also are an important part of the team and shouldn't be neglected on loot drops because they are not taking damage or doing damage.
Healing points should be raised.

0.85/1 tanking
1/1 healing
1/1 damage.

Boss has lot's of hp, so tank's get free points the longer the battle. They also get to deal damage.
Damage dealers, have to go through all of that health, but their damage will be higher to compensate.
Healing the tank is a necessary part of the team, and if failed will squad wipe. If they are able to do damage as well, great, but not needed.

Boss hp 8700
Boss hits 100 dmg per 2 seconds.
Boss takes 2 minutes to kill.

Tank is able to deal 25 dmg per 2 seconds.
Healer is able to heal the tank to full every 2 seconds. Can deal 40 damage every 4 turns. (1 turn = 2 seconds)
Damager dealer is able to hit 110 dmg per 2 seconds.

Outcome,
Tank get's hit 100 * 60, 6000 dmg. 5100 points.
Tank deals, 25 * 60 dmg, 1500 dmg. 1500 points.
Tank get's 6600 points.

Healer heals tank 100 dmg * 60, = 6000 damage, 6000 points
healer deals 40 * 15 dmg = 600 dmg. 600 points
Healer get's 6600 points.

Damager hits 110 * 60 dmg. 6600 dmg.
Damager get's 6600 points.


Using the above combination and roughly keeping the boss hp about 90x the damage the boss can deal, the stats should be roughly the same for all active party members.

--edit.

Remember hp will always need to go higher, because there are usually more damage dealers, and of course more dealers then tanks..

If 7 dmg dealers, 2 tanks and 3 healers..
The stats are gonna get messed up pretty bad.
The boss will die quicker, less dmg to tanks.. which means 2 things
Tanks' get more points, because health lost is lower.
Healers get less points because less health being lost.
Damage dealers get less points because of quantity of damagers.

Let's try the above.

Same boss.

Damage dealers deal 6600 damage per 2 minutes.
So roughly 1/7th of the time this time.
942 points per damager.

Tanks get hit 100 * 17 = 1700 hp. 1445 points
They deal 25 * 8 = 200 dmg, 200 points.
Tank get 1645 points.

Healers heal 1700 hp * 2 / 3.. 1133 points
healers deal 40 * 2 dmg = 80 points
1214 points.

See how the points got messed up?

There has to be a better system in place then a point system.. or change the points based on some parameters.

A better point system would count how active you are during a fight, and give a little extra points for your level.

For every 50 levels, gain 1 point per 10 seconds.
Have you been damaged within the past 10 seconds? 1.1 points.
Are you dealing damage equal to 4x your characters level within the past 10 seconds? 1.1 points.
Are you dealing damage less then double your character level within the past 10 seconds? 0.2 points.
Are you healing somebody other then yourself within the past 10 seconds? 0.9 points.

2 minute battle excluding level.

Tank get's 13.2 points for taking damage.
Tank get's 2.4 points for dealing damage.
15.6 points.

Healer get's 10.8 points for healing.
Healer get's 2.4 points for doing damage.
Healer was damaged twice. 2.2 points.
15.4 points.

Damager get's 13.2 points for dealing damage.
Got damaged twice. 2.2 points
15.4 points.

Abusing the above system can be done by taking extra damage then you are supposed to in your position.
Add another check.
If they have received the healer/damager points within the past 30 seconds then check next.
If they have received the damaging point within the past 60 seconds, they are unable to receive those points.

Idk.. just rambling at this point.

Good luck. :p

Thanks for the in-depth suggestion, going as far as giving calculations!
I think what you said is true, a point system based on heal, dmg and tank hit per point can be easily unbalanced . I didn't think about it until now, in cases of there being only one tanker, one healer and various shooters, the shooters will get less contribution points as the fight drags on and this is not what we intend.

I may have to look into the boss we're going to implement this to work on a optimal way of calculating points as well as work out a good way to calculate the average points and deviation so that we can make an even loot split if the standard deviation is small.

Your suggestion of point system based on contribution overtime is really good and can be seen as a better candidate for the position. With an reset if there's no contribution in x seconds it's the best idea so far.
It even prevent ghost chars, as their contribution overtime is insignificant as can be eliminated when handing over the loot.

I'm really thankful for the great post you made, and for taking the time to make it! I'll bring it to the other forums I posted this to see if we can brainstorm an even more awesome way to calculate points.
Thanks again. :)
 
Thanks for the in-depth suggestion, going as far as giving calculations!
I think what you said is true, a point system based on heal, dmg and tank hit per point can be easily unbalanced . I didn't think about it until now, in cases of there being only one tanker, one healer and various shooters, the shooters will get less contribution points as the fight drags on and this is not what we intend.

I may have to look into the boss we're going to implement this to work on a optimal way of calculating points as well as work out a good way to calculate the average points and deviation so that we can make an even loot split if the standard deviation is small.

Your suggestion of point system based on contribution overtime is really good and can be seen as a better candidate for the position. With an reset if there's no contribution in x seconds it's the best idea so far.
It even prevent ghost chars, as their contribution overtime is insignificant as can be eliminated when handing over the loot.

I'm really thankful for the great post you made, and for taking the time to make it! I'll bring it to the other forums I posted this to see if we can brainstorm an even more awesome way to calculate points.
Thanks again. :)
Good luck. :P
(Ps: there are definitely better ways, and I would ultimately like to see how your distribution system is set-up in the end. :D
 
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