Night Wolf
I don't bite.
- Joined
- Feb 10, 2008
- Messages
- 581
- Solutions
- 8
- Reaction score
- 929
- Location
- Spain
- GitHub
- andersonfaaria
As my comment on OTClientV8 (https://otland.net/threads/otclientv8.266603/) of @kondra was deleted due off-topic I'm creating this new thread in order to raise awareness on the matter that I have discussed there.
Before you go through all this text, first a food for thought:
How bad your team/project must be in order for your only advantage towards your competitors be "less bugs"? Why big servers and developers are so afraid to share bugs they have solved or things they have improved in the project? How selfish one needs to be in order to download a full project, improve/rewrite a system that could be benefical for everyone? (not only leechers, but also to save time for other developers focus on other parts or the thing that really matters which is his server content).
When did we lost the sense of a open project community and why 'big players' of the development are more and more away from it?
----- Original Comment posted there and later deleted --------
I was not going to waste any time on this because everyone that knows me knows as well my position regarding people trying to get profit from open source projects but I would like to discuss briefly regarding some points that are really bothering me a lot. If by any chance this post is deleted by the moderation, I will understand that this community is done.
1) How otland have kept this topic in the forum? I mean, I'm not even talking about a guy literally trying to scam people for money in a project that still has the sames bugs that regular otclient, I'm talking about a program that we have no way of knowing if it's malicious or not nor which data it collects from you. It may as well be collecting all the passwords that are inserted and trying to hack accounts from your server. Who knows? Even if someone here appears and says "hey, I bought the source and don't have any malicious code" it could just be a different build.
2) Please, for your own good. DO NOT CONSIDER BUYING THIS. Most of the 'optimizations' said we have no way of confirming without the source code so are you really going to waste money just to confirm if they are there or not? Also the moment we start to buy stuff from someone that literally just downloaded a full project from github and changed a bunch of lines we can cancel the open source community already. Under no circumstance this attitude should be endorsed.
3) This project still has SEVERAL bugs from original otclient, and I'm not talking about bugs that are 'hidden' and you need hard debugging skills to find out. Simple things that are missing and if you are a tibia player you could spot very very easily. This only show to me that whenever he was working on this, he didn't paid attention to very simple details and I would definitely take this in consideration before using this client/paying for the source.
4) As some have stated before, this has no use for someone who is a Developer because if you ever find a bug that are in the source you will have no way of fixing it and now you can count with Kondra's support but what if he dies/abandon community?
5) I @#$% hate the fact that iryont have become the 'contributor' of original edubart otclient. Like, he just closed all the issues I have reported just because he doesn't give a shit because his server already got them all fixed
I also hate the fact that otland as community don't give a damn about the otclient repository. I just wish I had more time to study its structure and perhaps supporting either the repo or slavi's version with Unity. It really piss me off to see someone charging for edits in a thing that should be the standard for a project. No wonder why edubart just abandoned the project.
Lastly, I would like to invite you all to consider the damage that those shitty attitudes are doing in the community. I have been working with OTs for a long time now (started in 2006 and been here in otland since 2008). When we are developing, our objective should never be to have less bugs than our friend who is also making his game as well. If you find something and you manage to fix it, you have the moral dutty to share the acknowledgement of the issue AND the solution. If you don't, what happens is that every other person who started the development will need to go through the same hell of spotting things and fixing them and we are taking years to evolve simple things from tfs and client because of this.
Like, we all have fixed tons of stuff from tfs and otclient but we don't want to share because others don't share as well. So the people who really have skills to do amazing things for the community, needs to read the whole source of two complex projects just to fix small details that everyone else either have fixed already and didn't contributed or paid something to do. The only people that likes this are the ones that rely on selling the same fix for 50 different people. We all spend more time fixing stuff that others have fixed already than properly developing our game story and working in what makes it unique.
Now regarding the otclient, we should put all our efforts to make it a perfect copy of tibia one because otherwise we will never be able to have it adopted by the vast majority of the otserver community (otadmins and players). So you might understand why people like Kondra are extremely toxic to this achievement even though he have the necessary skills to make a difference (by a glance at his github he seems to be a bachelor in CC) and he's familiar with the structure which is also a plus. I have nothing against him nor people selling specific stuff for servers, but when we are charging for something that should be the expected behavior it's a disgusting act. As a bachelor in CC I find it very disappointing to be working on my server for 6 years now and still spending more time in searching and fixing things than actually developing what will make my server outstand others.
TL;DR version: Don't be stupid and let's share more, that's the only way to convince others to share and help community grow. We NEED stable and optimized tfs and an otclient that is a perfect copy of tibia's one in order for everyone to move on and start focusing their time in developing real custom things instead of regular quickfixes and improvements.
List of bugs that I'm aware of otclient that may be replicable in kondra's version as well:
b) selling items that are not supposed to be bought from npc
c) Crashing
Reference issue Sell All bugs · Issue #891 · edubart/otclient (https://github.com/edubart/otclient/issues/891) (closed by iryont without any solution)
Things to be done in OTC:
Before you go through all this text, first a food for thought:
How bad your team/project must be in order for your only advantage towards your competitors be "less bugs"? Why big servers and developers are so afraid to share bugs they have solved or things they have improved in the project? How selfish one needs to be in order to download a full project, improve/rewrite a system that could be benefical for everyone? (not only leechers, but also to save time for other developers focus on other parts or the thing that really matters which is his server content).
When did we lost the sense of a open project community and why 'big players' of the development are more and more away from it?
----- Original Comment posted there and later deleted --------
I was not going to waste any time on this because everyone that knows me knows as well my position regarding people trying to get profit from open source projects but I would like to discuss briefly regarding some points that are really bothering me a lot. If by any chance this post is deleted by the moderation, I will understand that this community is done.
1) How otland have kept this topic in the forum? I mean, I'm not even talking about a guy literally trying to scam people for money in a project that still has the sames bugs that regular otclient, I'm talking about a program that we have no way of knowing if it's malicious or not nor which data it collects from you. It may as well be collecting all the passwords that are inserted and trying to hack accounts from your server. Who knows? Even if someone here appears and says "hey, I bought the source and don't have any malicious code" it could just be a different build.
2) Please, for your own good. DO NOT CONSIDER BUYING THIS. Most of the 'optimizations' said we have no way of confirming without the source code so are you really going to waste money just to confirm if they are there or not? Also the moment we start to buy stuff from someone that literally just downloaded a full project from github and changed a bunch of lines we can cancel the open source community already. Under no circumstance this attitude should be endorsed.
3) This project still has SEVERAL bugs from original otclient, and I'm not talking about bugs that are 'hidden' and you need hard debugging skills to find out. Simple things that are missing and if you are a tibia player you could spot very very easily. This only show to me that whenever he was working on this, he didn't paid attention to very simple details and I would definitely take this in consideration before using this client/paying for the source.
4) As some have stated before, this has no use for someone who is a Developer because if you ever find a bug that are in the source you will have no way of fixing it and now you can count with Kondra's support but what if he dies/abandon community?
5) I @#$% hate the fact that iryont have become the 'contributor' of original edubart otclient. Like, he just closed all the issues I have reported just because he doesn't give a shit because his server already got them all fixed
I also hate the fact that otland as community don't give a damn about the otclient repository. I just wish I had more time to study its structure and perhaps supporting either the repo or slavi's version with Unity. It really piss me off to see someone charging for edits in a thing that should be the standard for a project. No wonder why edubart just abandoned the project.
Lastly, I would like to invite you all to consider the damage that those shitty attitudes are doing in the community. I have been working with OTs for a long time now (started in 2006 and been here in otland since 2008). When we are developing, our objective should never be to have less bugs than our friend who is also making his game as well. If you find something and you manage to fix it, you have the moral dutty to share the acknowledgement of the issue AND the solution. If you don't, what happens is that every other person who started the development will need to go through the same hell of spotting things and fixing them and we are taking years to evolve simple things from tfs and client because of this.
Like, we all have fixed tons of stuff from tfs and otclient but we don't want to share because others don't share as well. So the people who really have skills to do amazing things for the community, needs to read the whole source of two complex projects just to fix small details that everyone else either have fixed already and didn't contributed or paid something to do. The only people that likes this are the ones that rely on selling the same fix for 50 different people. We all spend more time fixing stuff that others have fixed already than properly developing our game story and working in what makes it unique.
Now regarding the otclient, we should put all our efforts to make it a perfect copy of tibia one because otherwise we will never be able to have it adopted by the vast majority of the otserver community (otadmins and players). So you might understand why people like Kondra are extremely toxic to this achievement even though he have the necessary skills to make a difference (by a glance at his github he seems to be a bachelor in CC) and he's familiar with the structure which is also a plus. I have nothing against him nor people selling specific stuff for servers, but when we are charging for something that should be the expected behavior it's a disgusting act. As a bachelor in CC I find it very disappointing to be working on my server for 6 years now and still spending more time in searching and fixing things than actually developing what will make my server outstand others.
TL;DR version: Don't be stupid and let's share more, that's the only way to convince others to share and help community grow. We NEED stable and optimized tfs and an otclient that is a perfect copy of tibia's one in order for everyone to move on and start focusing their time in developing real custom things instead of regular quickfixes and improvements.
List of bugs that I'm aware of otclient that may be replicable in kondra's version as well:
- In trade he makes just one column of items instead of two, there's a workaround for this if you resize the window twice but we should try to have this fixed.
- When you activate the 'Move to Panels' option and moves'inventory window' up and down other window panels it creates a vacumn window panel in the middle.
- Sell all has 432652137852 bugs, we should rework it or remove this. The functions that gather items from player and from npc are a mess and it creates several possibilities for people to edit the module and creates things that are not checked by TFS side, which will cause crashes. I was able to reproduce:
b) selling items that are not supposed to be bought from npc
c) Crashing
Reference issue Sell All bugs · Issue #891 · edubart/otclient (https://github.com/edubart/otclient/issues/891) (closed by iryont without any solution)
- Xp gain still missing from skills tab
- When opening a new pannel, it should always be created below the last panel, sometimes they go in the wrong order.
- When opening a modal, the first option needs to come selected by default otherwise you may cause errors/crashes if this isn't treated in lua side.
- When you're attacking with chase mode, if you move it needs to be disabled and moved to 'stand' mode. Don't know about the v8 otc but definetely in the otland one we still have this problem sometimes.
- The player light is very odd. This one I'm not sure if the rework done by Kondra have fixed because I couldn't test.
- In some situations the map flags don't work properly. Can't replicate though.
- When you send a message to someone, the channel with this person opens but you're not redirected to it as the default client does.
- Life bar should only be red BELOW 20% health, currently otc is marking as red even when in cip's client your life is yellow.
- Stack items in client (items on upper floors preventing to click in an item in the screen)
Reference issue [10.98] Not able to use some items near walls with borders on top · Issue #46 · otland/otclient (https://github.com/otland/otclient/issues/46)
Things to be done in OTC:
- When you click full map, you need to create a button for 'back' and make ESC button in keyword activate that. Many players that are going into OTC first time struggle with that and re-login because they don't know in advance the keyboard command to toggle between full map and minimized version.
- Default layout (done in otc v8)
- WASD working with enter. (When in WASD mode, if you press enter you toggle write mode but when you enter again to send the message you should instantly go back to WASD mode.
- Addons being checked by default when you are switching the outfits.
Last edited: